
Not content with flouting the Constitution's limits on Executive Branch power, Cheney has put forth a new interpretation of the Constitution which says that the Vice President's office is exempt from the President's Executive Order requiring all Executive Branch agencies and offices to report a tally of the enumber of documents classified each year. Cheney says that because the VP's office has executive and legislative duties -- the VP is President of the Senate -- he is not bound by orders applying to the Executive Branch.
Got that? The President directs the Executive Branch by Executive Orders. If the Vice President is not required to follow those orders, then who is the most powerful person in the Government?
"As the Bush administration has dramatically accelerated the classification of information as "top secret" or "confidential," one office is refusing to report on its annual activity in classifying documents: the office of Vice President Dick Cheney.
A standing executive order, strengthened by President Bush in 2003, requires all agencies and "any other entity within the executive branch" to provide an annual accounting of their classification of documents. More than 80 agencies have collectively reported to the National Archives that they made 15.6 million decisions in 2004 to classify information, nearly double the number in 2001, but Cheney continues to insist he is exempt.
Explaining why the vice president has withheld even a tally of his office's secrecy when such offices as the National Security Council routinely report theirs, a spokeswoman said Cheney is "not under any duty" to provide it."
Evano how many terms can a VP serve ?
a VP serves with a president, so they serve as long as he does. If the VP wants to run with another candidate after the 2 term limit, I believe they're allowed to do so, but I don't think it's ever been done.
On paper: I would imagine two, just like president.
In real life application: Apparently too many.
He could just take another position though say Defense portfolio ? Where as Bush is out after 2 terms is this correct ?
There is no Constitutional limit on the number of terms a Vice President can serve. The 22nd Amendment, which discusses Presidential term limits, never mentions the Vice President. The only Constitutional restrictions are that, if the VP should serve more than two years as an Acting President, due to the President's death or inability to continue in office, the VP would only be eligible to be elected President for a single term. I guess, if John McCain wanted, he could have Cheney as his running mate in 2008.
Thanks for that evano. Now I feel strange I am on Bush's side if this is the case. If the president can only serve two terms than he should have a lot of power because in theory he is representing the people. So I suppose the Dictatorship ( 2nd term ) is an advantage in this system because it limits the President from becoming a cult. That means that Power rests where with the senate ?, Surly even the republican party has long term strategies ? Who else besides the president has executive power ?
Actually, the theory of the Constitution is that the Congress represents the people. In fact, the Constitution as written only required that the people would vote for the members of the House of Representatives. The legislatures of the states would appoint the Senators and also the Electors, who would then elect the President. It wasn't until 1917 that the Constitution was amended to have Senators elected by popular vote. There is still no Constitutional requirement that the President be elected by popular vote. Although George Washington, the first President, set a precedent by choosing not to run for a third term, there was no provision for term limits until 1951, as a reaction towards President Roosevelt's being elected for a fourth term in 1944.
Technically, there is no "most powerful" branch of the US government. Each branch has powers and limits to powers and is subject to checks and balances from each other branch. Congress was seen as the most important branch by the Framers, and therefore, it was addressed first in the Constitution. It alone was given the power to raise money and spend money, and only Congress could write laws, although they had no power to enforce or execute the laws. All bills to spend money have to originate in the House of Representatives, but the Senate can add amendments. The Senate is also presided over by the Vice President (who is actually mentioned in the Constitution before the President.)
Fearful of the potential of tyranny, many of the Framers didn't want to have a single executive; a committee was suggested by some, while a leader chosen by the Congress was preferred by others. The final outcome was to have an executive who had specifically described powers. He was to be Commander-in-Chief of the armed forces, but he could not go to war without Congress declaring war. While he commands the forces, Congress pays them and has the power to create rules governing their behavior. The Executive gets to sign the laws written by Congress and he must enforce and execute the laws. If he doesn't approve of a law he can veto it; Congress must then revise it and re-submit it, or they may override his veto with a super-majority. The Executive can nominate Ambassadors and sign treaties, but the Senate must consent to the choices and ratify the treaties with a super-majority before they take effect.
The third branch, the Judiciary, consists of a Supreme Court mandated by the Constitution and whatever lesser courts Congress sees fit to establish. The President gets to nominate members of the judiciary, but all nominees must be confirmed by a super-majority of the Senate. Although not specified in the Constitution, an early ruling by the Supreme Court interpreted its role to include judicial review of Congressional laws; there is some controversy about this power, but it has stood for more than 200 years. The justices are appointed for life terms, and the Chief Justice gets to preside over impeachments of the President. Impeachment charges must be brought by the House, but the trial occurs before the Senate.
Okay, so much for the American civics lesson. It's twisted and purposely inefficient to prevent any one branch from taking on too much power. As usual, I went on too long, but I hope it makes some sense.
No it wasn't to long I'm glad the judicial system has some form of executive power. It is a strange way to make a three teared assembly though. It could be streamlined at the very least. It is a difficult task to make a three teared assembly work. Still I now understand a little more about the U.S. political animal Thanks.
Evano a ?
If things go full course and eventually the current serving President is impeached (many here for and against but this is NOT the debate), has there ever been an Impeachment trial where the Chief Justice was appointed by the same President being Impeached?
JJ
Even as a conservative I've been beating this dead horse for a long time. It appears to me, one of the most misused powers we have in government and I don't care what administration you pledge allegiance to.
Cheney is only vocalizing and demonstrating, what countless executive, judicial and legislative branches have done quietly and tactfully for decades. Please know we have a history of generating endless "decrees" and an equally strong history of ignoring those same Presidential Executive Orders when they no longer suit our country's purposes.
@Jess Jessep,
No, a quick review thru Wikipedia shows that none of the Presidents who have ever been subject to impeachment (Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton) had appointed a Chief Justice during their term in office.
Richard Nixon had appointed Warren E. Burger as Chief Justice, but Nixon resigned before a formal impeachment process could take place on his administration.
Thanks, Cary. I was saving Western civilization on another thread somewhere, so you beat me to it. :)
Top jedi: You are right: the abuse of Executive Orders is not a partisan issue. They are a dangerous power which the Executive has seized for himself, extra-Constitutionally. That said, a lot of EOs are actually necessary for the Executive Branch to operate. Since the President is the head of the Executive branch, he issues some of the EOs like memos directing different departments to focus on one issue, or increase staff on something else, or provide this material to that person... you get the picture. It's the ones which actually work as legislation which are stepping over the line. The document classification rules, for example, work as national laws since they regulate not only the Executive branch, but the Legislative branch, the Judicial branch, state governments and individuals, too. These rules have never been written into law by Congress, yet they provide for penalties, they require funding, and they require staff. Those are not within the enumerated powers of the Executive Branch.
Still, if the other government branches have acquiesced so far in adhering to these EOs as if they were law, then why does the Vice President feel that he is not required to be subject to that law himself? That situation is even more ridiculous in that the President declares he has powers not specified in the Constitution which must be followed by all Americans, and the Vice President declares that he doesn't even have to follow those laws. What was that phrase again: "a nation of laws, not men?"
Yes evano, I think what is missing in the EO process is a ratification by another branch or more independent legal review process. EOs do indeed represent such a wide mix of policy from global boycotts to departmental org changes, that without a review process we all lose in the long run.
Excellent job on what the Founders set up in the Constitution. It is a pity that we have gotten so far from that vision through legal and perhaps not as legal methods. Too be fair though all branches of government have tried and do grab power that wasn't granted to them in the Constitution. I some times think it is a shame that we can't start over with the Constitution in it orignal form (although including a number of obvious admendments beyond the top ten) but that is wshful thinking.
Evano thank you for using the term extra-Constitutionally. Like extra legal ! This sort of clear language makes it so much easier to understand. :)
where did that guy come from?
every day he does something to amaze me with his gall.
I am unsure what amazes me more, 1) that Cheney is this arrogant or 2) he really believes what he says
Wow. Just amazing, just amazing. The question becomes, is this something Bush as quietly agreed to and supports? It would seem unusual for Cheney's office to make such a claim without some sort of prior approval, and if he does have it, the bigger question becomes why? Of course, that is really the question about the whole reclassification issue to begin with. Why? What vital, state secrets are in danger of being (already) exposed? And can Congress do anything about it (not that a Republican controlled Congress would)?
So Dick Cheney says he's immune from having to follow the law? Are you serious?
I need to sit down.
No Dick is saying he is immune to Bush's laws :-) Pretty soon every politician will get a mulligan to pass over on their least popular executive order. Starting to sound pretty silly.
Actually he is saying he doesn't have to follow a rule that applies to the executive branch of government as he wrongly believes he is a member of the legislative body (acting as President of the Senate).
In theory he is right, the legislative branch doesn't have to follow the rules as those rules do not apply to them.
brgiant: Because Constitutional interpretation can be as flexible as Biblical interpretations, I can see someone making an argument that, since the Vice President's only duties spelled out in the body of the Constitution are to preside over the Senate, he is actually a part of the Legislative branch. I don't believe that is a proper interpretation, but Mr. Cheney has bigger lawyers than I do... not to mention a shotgun in the closet. :)
And, technically, Executive Orders shouldn't apply outside the Executive Branch, but as I pointed out above, some of the EOs have exceeded the boundaries of the Executive Branch and imposed rules with the force of law on other branches.
Interesting. Normally the VP is thought of as the shadow of the President.
Instead of being a shadow, Cheney is saying the VP is the leader of a shadow government that acts independently of the President, without oversight, without answering to anyone or anything.
There must be a reason for the shadows to assert themselves in the open. Unfortunately I can't think of a GOOD reason. Just bad ones.
at the same time, doesn't this mean that in essence, the president could funnel actions through the VP's office and thus "hide" them from his own executive orders?
am i reading too much into this or could this actually be a loophole that the administration is using purposefully.
I have often wondered how the US would function as a parliamentary democracy of some kind, e.g. where the president was elected by an electoral college. In a 2-party system, there won't be the coalition politics that are the bane of other parliamentary democracies. However, I doubt that the oft-seen case where the executive and the legislature are from different parties would happen too often if the executive was chosen indirectly.
And here I thought the President was elected by an electoral college.... silly me.
I think what mndoci is referring to is what the original design and purpose of the electoral college was. The founders originally intended for the President to be elected by Congress, not directly by the people. What we call the electoral college today is a joke compared to what it was supposed to be. Essentially, the founders didn't want the President to be a political position in the sense that they are elected directly by the people. They felt that a college of peers knew best who should be president, not the general public.
One correction, jmack: your explanation is basically on target, but the Electors were to be chosen by the State legislatures; Senators and Representatives were specifically prohibited from being Electors. The States were left to decide how to appoint the Electors, but the President wasn't expected to be chosen by popular vote.
You're right, evano, a detail I had forgotten about. Yes, each of the states sent their electors to vote on President. Originally the electors were chosen by the state legislatures, but as time went on more and more states started selecting their electors by way of popular vote and eventually it digressed into the form we have today. I believe the original purpose of electing the President this way was to shield the position from the sort of public influence that other directly elected positions had to contend with.
I agree the framers of the Constitution and our Government did not intend to create a King. A more practical issue that I have with Cheney's actions is the loss of the information to scrutiny by other intelligence or police agencies. They are classifying information in an attempt to restrict access to what they deem as damaging to their interests. The information was gathered with our tax dollars and should be used by all public and private interest to secure the long term interests of our Nation not the Bush/Cheney fiasco. The more your classify something the more difficult it is to be used. (Experience speaking here)
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